SDR# TETRA Demodulator Trunk Tracking Demonstration

hamradionl · Feb 28, 2019

After 3 days full running the SDR# crasht

An item with the same key has already been added.
at mscorlib.dll.ThrowHelper.ThrowArgumentException (IL offset: 0x10)
at mscorlib.dll.Dictionary`2.Insert (IL offset: 0x81)
at SDRSharp.Tetra.dll.SdsParser.ParseTextMessage (IL offset: 0x9a)
at SDRSharp.Tetra.dll.SdsParser.ParseSDS (IL offset: 0x2aa)
at SDRSharp.Tetra.dll.CMCE_protocol.ParseCMCEPDU (IL offset: 0x0)
at SDRSharp.Tetra.dll.MleLevel.Parse (IL offset: 0x3a)
at SDRSharp.Tetra.dll.LlcLevel.Parse (IL offset: 0xd0)
at SDRSharp.Tetra.dll.MacLevel.MacEndPDU (IL offset: 0xb5)
at SDRSharp.Tetra.dll.MacLevel.TmoParseMacPDU (IL offset: 0xf7)
at SDRSharp.Tetra.dll.TetraDecoder.Process (IL offset: 0x1da8)
at SDRSharp.Tetra.dll.TetraPanel.DecodingThread (IL offset: 0x98)
at mscorlib.dll.ThreadHelper.ThreadStart_Context (IL offset: 0x14)
at mscorlib.dll.ExecutionContext.RunInternal (IL offset: 0x79)
at mscorlib.dll.ExecutionContext.Run (IL offset: 0x0)
at mscorlib.dll.ExecutionContext.Run (IL offset: 0x2b)
at mscorlib.dll.ThreadHelper.ThreadStart (IL offset: 0x8)

albert1987 · Feb 28, 2019

Hi thewraith2008,

I'm monitoring another Tetra network without Air interface encryption interface enabled.
In the log of Network Info I see the followings SDS strings

SSI:500 D_SDS_Data Party_SSI:407 Type:UDT-4 Length:184 Protocol:Simple_location_system DATA:'0000001110000000000100110001001100100011001011110011010000011111100011001011100100011011011101110110011000111001010110001000101010101011000011001010111010101101100000110101011000000000' LocationSystemCodingScheme:User defined

SSI:500 D_SDS_Data Party_SSI:390 Type:UDT-4 Length:184 Protocol:Simple_location_system DATA:'0000001110000000000100110001001100100011001011110011010000011111100011001011100100011011100000000110011000111001010110001000111101001010000011001010111010010101001111110101011000000000' LocationSystemCodingScheme:User defined

Do you think is it possible read it?
Thanks

thewraith2008 · Feb 28, 2019

hamradionl said:
After 3 days full running the SDR# crasht

An item with the same key has already been added.
at mscorlib.dll.ThrowHelper.ThrowArgumentException (IL offset: 0x10)
at mscorlib.dll.Dictionary`2.Insert (IL offset: 0x81)
at SDRSharp.Tetra.dll.SdsParser.ParseTextMessage (IL offset: 0x9a)
at SDRSharp.Tetra.dll.SdsParser.ParseSDS (IL offset: 0x2aa)
at SDRSharp.Tetra.dll.CMCE_protocol.ParseCMCEPDU (IL offset: 0x0)
at SDRSharp.Tetra.dll.MleLevel.Parse (IL offset: 0x3a)
at SDRSharp.Tetra.dll.LlcLevel.Parse (IL offset: 0xd0)
at SDRSharp.Tetra.dll.MacLevel.MacEndPDU (IL offset: 0xb5)
at SDRSharp.Tetra.dll.MacLevel.TmoParseMacPDU (IL offset: 0xf7)
at SDRSharp.Tetra.dll.TetraDecoder.Process (IL offset: 0x1da8)
at SDRSharp.Tetra.dll.TetraPanel.DecodingThread (IL offset: 0x98)
at mscorlib.dll.ThreadHelper.ThreadStart_Context (IL offset: 0x14)
at mscorlib.dll.ExecutionContext.RunInternal (IL offset: 0x79)
at mscorlib.dll.ExecutionContext.Run (IL offset: 0x0)
at mscorlib.dll.ExecutionContext.Run (IL offset: 0x2b)
at mscorlib.dll.ThreadHelper.ThreadStart (IL offset: 0x8)

Yes, this has already been identified and fixed (for next release). Thanks.
This is because some SDS messages have a message reference element and some don't. I forgot to add code to test this for SDS protocols that are not supported. (Where a binary string is output)

albert1987 said:
Hi thewraith2008,
I'm monitoring another Tetra network without Air interface encryption interface enabled.
In the log of Network Info I see the followings SDS strings

SSI:500 D_SDS_Data Party_SSI:407 Type:UDT-4 Length:184 Protocol:Simple_location_system DATA:'0000001110000000000100110001001100100011001011110011010000011111100011001011100100011011011101110110011000111001010110001000101010101011000011001010111010101101100000110101011000000000' LocationSystemCodingScheme:User defined

SSI:500 D_SDS_Data Party_SSI:390 Type:UDT-4 Length:184 Protocol:Simple_location_system DATA:'0000001110000000000100110001001100100011001011110011010000011111100011001011100100011011100000000110011000111001010110001000111101001010000011001010111010010101001111110101011000000000' LocationSystemCodingScheme:User defined

Do you think is it possible read it?
Thanks

No.
"LocationSystemCodingScheme:User defined" means the format of the data within 'UDT-4' is defined by end user, i.e. unknown.

You could run it through a online binary to text converter, but most likely it's some proprietary format/control codes that will be meaningless without knowing how to interpret them.

Latest version (v1.0.13) can be found here: Release post

albert1987 · Feb 28, 2019

thewraith2008 said:
No.
"LocationSystemCodingScheme:User defined" means the format of the data within 'UDT-4' is defined by end user, i.e. unknown.

You could run it through a online binary to text converter, but most likely it's some proprietary format/control codes that will be meaningless without knowing how to interpret them.

Latest version (v1.0.13) can be found here: Release post

Ok, thanks thewraith2008
I tried to decode it using an online text converter but as you say seems to be used an unknown format.

oz1jua · Mar 2, 2019

I've seen something similar to what you've seen. I see this all the time on our local train. I previously got sq5bpf to decode this in Telive and he told me that it was something that both told the location, speed and direction of the train plus some tecnical status of the train.
14:16:03 - SSI:xxx D_SDS_Data Party_SSI:100 Type:UDT-4 Length:32 Protocol:User_Defined_192

thewraith2008 · Mar 2, 2019

oz1jua said:
I've seen something similar to what you've seen. I see this all the time on our local train. I previously got sq5bpf to decode this in Telive and he told me that it was something that both told the location, speed and direction of the train plus some tecnical status of the train.
14:16:03 - SSI:xxx D_SDS_Data Party_SSI:100 Type:UDT-4 Length:32 Protocol:User_Defined_192

I'd find it hard to believe that with only "Length:32" (that's 32 bits, assuming no other overhead) that it would be able to convey all that information.

alberts1987 binary string to text, assuming 8 bits per character and that converting to text is done anyway is:

Code:

&#8364;#/4
&#338;
&#185;
&#8364;f9X
&#143;J
&#174;
&#8226;?V

The "&#" could indicate HTML codes

Code:

&#8364; euro sign (€)
&#338;  latin capital letter OE (Œ)
&#185;  superscript one (¹)
&#8364; euro sign (€)
&#143;  ?
&#174;  registered trade mark sign (®)
&#8226  bullet (•)

Code:

€#/4Œ¹€f9X ? J®•

Does that mean anything to anyone?

Latest version (v1.0.13) can be found here: Release post

syscodec · Mar 3, 2019

oz1jua said:
I've seen something similar to what you've seen. I see this all the time on our local train. I previously got sq5bpf to decode this in Telive and he told me that it was something that both told the location, speed and direction of the train plus some tecnical status of the train.
14:16:03 - SSI:xxx D_SDS_Data Party_SSI:100 Type:UDT-4 Length:32 Protocol:User_Defined_192

Maybe possible, e.g.
8 bits for speed
3 bits for direction
8 bits for technical info, e.g. bit 0 = x, bits 1-2 = something ...
13 bits for location code, e.g. 1 = station x, 8 = railway number x ...

hamradionl · Mar 3, 2019

thewraith2008,

Code:

&#8364; euro sign (€)
&#338;  latin capital letter OE (Œ)
&#185;  superscript one (¹)
&#8364; euro sign (€)
&#143;  ?
&#174;  registered trade mark sign (®)
&#8226  bullet (•)

Code:

€#/4Œ¹€f9X ? J®•

When it is a train, maby to control if the passenger has pay for his ticket?
When it is a train, maby its price changing for the ticket shown on the train computer screen?
Or indication for particular destination price cost and this is changed by OTR control center?

oz1jua
You right aboutthis, in past when i used Telive, i seen some GPS strings on a network.

hamradionl · Mar 3, 2019

TSSDR or thewraith2008
Tetra plugin / TTT frequency safe function
Some network use 2 or 3 MAIN LA freq (LA-1, LA-2 and LA-3)
When switch to other network LA, every time need to manual setup the PARK frequency
Is it possible make some frequency manage function to easy switch between network MAIN freq LA (by mouse clicking) to monitor other MAIN LA frequency ?
So collect a list of all MAIN freq LA en simply click in that list and Tetra / TTT to switch to other network MAIN freq LA

Ubbe · Mar 3, 2019

hamradionl said:
So collect a list of all MAIN freq LA en simply click in that list and Tetra / TTT to switch to other network MAIN freq LA

I use the Frequency Manager in #SDR for that. I have one group for each system and in each group I have the control channels.

/Ubbe

hamradionl · Mar 3, 2019

Ubbe,
Thank you advice,
I use freq manager for setup all local 18 Control channels, when click or dubble click inside the freq list, TTT starts jumping or scan between the freq in this list, like sort scanner. After turn OFF and ON the Tetra decoder, using the Checkbox, its switch to other Control channel and not jumping.
It look like something to do with that TTT set the Control channel in temporary memory, so TTT keep coming back to that channel?
Or,
do i need not all Control Channel in one group but make seperate groups?

DarkAngelT · Mar 3, 2019

Is there a way to use tetra demodulator in the cell phone?

DarkAngelT · Mar 3, 2019

I bought another SDR to use in dual mode and realized the same error that happened in other versions of TTT when listening in dual mode.

After one to two hours running the SDR SHARP that is doing the "VC" function freezes.
The "CC" continues to function but due to the "VC" being frozen, the communication stops.
I have to close the SDR SHARP "VC" and open again to be able to work.

I do not understand why this happens. But this has always happened to me, since the early versions of TTT.

hamradionl · Mar 3, 2019

DarkAngelT
I test run on 2x Brand New PC 1x have win10 Fresh install no other program install no other program running
With me it start from version 1.09 hotfix, latest Full version 1.13 this run for days but 1 time it crash (see above message)
I update . NET to the latest new version (4.7)
Turn OFF to USB power safe function
I use the modify TSSDR RTL-SDR 820T driver, better sensitivity and extra tuning the LNA + frontend.

thewraith2008 · Mar 4, 2019

hamradionl said:
TSSDR or thewraith2008
Tetra plugin / TTT frequency safe function
Some network use 2 or 3 MAIN LA freq (LA-1, LA-2 and LA-3)
When switch to other network LA, every time need to manual setup the PARK frequency
Is it possible make some frequency manage function to easy switch between network MAIN freq LA (by mouse clicking) to monitor other MAIN LA frequency ?
So collect a list of all MAIN freq LA en simply click in that list and Tetra / TTT to switch to other network MAIN freq LA

Just selecting the new LA (MCCH frequency) in SDR# CC frequency spectrum is all one needs to do. TTT will setup the rest.
Also Ubbe suggestion is another good idea.

In any case I have added for next release a basic LA selector, a channel changer if you will.
This feature uses a new "TETRA_la.txt" file format to allow switching to a new frequency. (adds a new frequency element to each entry)
Will be accessible from a 2nd 'Presets' panel.
Will show a dropbox with a list of available LAs. Will show as "LA:5 - Label here if exists"

Please note by design, TTT when it switches to new frequency, will try and determine the MCCH of the new frequency. If the reported MCCH of the new frequency is not on the same frequency as the one just switched too, then TTT will switch to the reported MCCH.
So in others words, don't add carriers that are not MCCH to the "TETRA_la.txt"

Latest version (v1.0.13) can be found here: Release post

RMW1010 · Mar 4, 2019

thewraith2008 said:
Just selecting the new LA (MCCH frequency) in SDR# CC frequency spectrum is all one needs to do. TTT will setup the rest.

Since the last version I seem to have an issue with that.

When I select a different LA it reverts back to the initial LA and then keeps on switching between the 2.

hamradionl · Mar 4, 2019

RMW1010 said:
Since the last version I seem to have an issue with that.
When I select a different LA it reverts back to the initial LA and then keeps on switching between the 2.

I notice the same problem, see my message #669 / #671
When you have 3x LA MCCH control channel, it switch between 3x LA MCCH control channel i must turn off Decoder to stop the switching

TSSDR or thewraith2008
TETRA_la.txt seem like good starting point, thank you both.

Wait the new release

thewraith2008 · Mar 4, 2019

RMW1010 said:
Since the last version I seem to have an issue with that.

When I select a different LA it reverts back to the initial LA and then keeps on switching between the 2.

hamradionl said:
I notice the same problem, see my message #669 / #671
When you have 3x LA MCCH control channel, it switch between 3x LA MCCH control channel i must turn off Decoder to stop the switching

TSSDR or thewraith2008
TETRA_la.txt seem like good starting point, thank you both.

Wait the new release

I tried adding 3 MCCH (frequencies) to the frequency manager (assuming you are using the SDR# default one) and clicking and double clicking each entry, but I'm not seeing what you describe. I see it switch to the frequency and stay there decoding as expected.

I select a MCCH in SDR# CC frequency spectrum and still don't see what you describe. I see it switch to the frequency and stay there decoding as expected.

Do you you use more than 1 setup of SDR#(CC/VC) + plugin and TTT?

Latest version (v1.0.13) can be found here: Release post

hamradionl · Mar 4, 2019

TSSDR or thewraith2008
2x PC's WIN10 and both run 1x setup SDR# 1700 + TTT 1.13 in Dualmode CC + VC using 2x RTL-SDR
It look like when there are more FREQ in the list manager or use "SHOW ALL" in manager, TTT start switching between LA.
When use different groups in manager, it still keep switching to the LA inside the other manager group

I need turn OFF decoderbox and turn ON decoderbox again, to stop the switching.
Funny isn't it, this free scanning functing?
But just wait for the TETRA-LA.txt and see what that bring.

hamradionl · Mar 4, 2019

thewraith2008
Last week i try this test setup for monitor LA-1, LA-2, LA-3 used in the same Network
Run multiple RTL-SDR + SDR# + TTT only in SINGLE mode and copy all the files in different folders
SDRTetra-01, SDRTetra-02, SDRTetra-03
TetraTrunkTrack-01.exe, TetraTrunkTrack-02.exe, TetraTrunkTrack-03.exe
this setup seem to work for short period time, not for long because i think still writing in the same GSSi and SSi txt file, this causing problems

.

SDR# TETRA Demodulator Trunk Tracking Demonstration

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