Cleveland National Forest New Forest Net
- Thread starter KK6UME
- Start date
Possibly the Macy fire where Highway 74 loops down from the mountains to Lake Elsinore
Air Tactics 51 is unassigned, just like Air Tactics 30-42. 168.0625 is not on the list of R5 unassigned air tactics frequencies, so it must be an unused federal frequency of an unknown (to us) agency. Funny they would go to one of those when they have so many unused Air to Air Tactics (FM) frequencies.
From Air Tactics 43-66 there are 10 frequencies unassigned. They are 45, 48-51 and 56-60. So that is 22 frequencies unassigned including those from 30-42. I wonder why some of those assigned are used by more than one forest. I would expect to see some unassigned show up on an extended attack fire, like your observation of Air Tactics 51.
Adding Utility 28
320R
Brush 288
Comms 22, 26, 27, 28, 29
2Charles1 (Patrol Captain)
2Edward 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 10, 11, 12
Engineer 325
2King 1 & 5 (canine units)
Lookout 03, 41, 50, 51 57, 62 (Palomar), 86 & 87 (KCB591 Boucher Hill)
Patrol 21, 22, 23, 33, 34, 41, 42
Prevention 24
Ranger 2
Rec 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 31
Trails 21, 25
2Tom 2 (LEO Trainee)
Utility 28, 36
320R
Brush 288
Comms 22, 26, 27, 28, 29
2Charles1 (Patrol Captain)
2Edward 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 10, 11, 12
Engineer 325
2King 1 & 5 (canine units)
Lookout 03, 41, 50, 51 57, 62 (Palomar), 86 & 87 (KCB591 Boucher Hill)
Patrol 21, 22, 23, 33, 34, 41, 42
Prevention 24
Ranger 2
Rec 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 31
Trails 21, 25
2Tom 2 (LEO Trainee)
Utility 28, 36
Adding Patrol 24
Adding Utility 28
320R
Brush 288
Comms 22, 26, 27, 28, 29
2Charles1 (Patrol Captain)
2Edward 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 10, 11, 12
Engineer 325
2King 1 & 5 (canine units)
Lookout 03, 41, 50, 51 57, 62 (Palomar), 86 & 87 (KCB591 Boucher Hill)
Patrol 21, 22, 23, 24, 33, 34, 41, 42
Prevention 24
Ranger 2
Rec 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 31
Trails 21, 25
2Tom 2 (LEO Trainee)
Utility 28, 36
Adding Utility 28
320R
Brush 288
Comms 22, 26, 27, 28, 29
2Charles1 (Patrol Captain)
2Edward 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 10, 11, 12
Engineer 325
2King 1 & 5 (canine units)
Lookout 03, 41, 50, 51 57, 62 (Palomar), 86 & 87 (KCB591 Boucher Hill)
Patrol 21, 22, 23, 24, 33, 34, 41, 42
Prevention 24
Ranger 2
Rec 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 31
Trails 21, 25
2Tom 2 (LEO Trainee)
Utility 28, 36
Keep track if you hear Prevention 24 and Patrol 24 in service on the same day. I believe the position is one in the same. Perhaps the actual truck or truck with utility box and small pump and water tank was in for repair or its annual inspection. The person that staffs Patrol 24 then found a regular pickup without the Type VII engine and patrolled as "Prevention 24" (a dry unit and once the Patrol 24 Type VII engine was back from the shop, the same person began to ID as "Patrol 24." It would be very unusual for there to be a Patrol and Prevention 24 as they would respond from the same station and cover the same ground. If I'm right you won't be hearing Prevention 24 until next year's round of annual inspection of vehicles.
EDIT: it could also be that the fleet replacement for Patrol 24's vehicle was held up by procurement delays and only recently got delivered. In that case you won't hear Prevention 24 in the coming weeks.
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Fire Watch Tower Volunteers...
151.940mhz
MURS
"L.B.R." Little Black Radio
Simplex tower 2 tower
San Diego County
151.940mhz
MURS
"L.B.R." Little Black Radio
Simplex tower 2 tower
San Diego County
Which fire tower location is that? I wonder why they are not talking on CNF frequencies to call in?
Adding Lookout 13
Adding Utility 28
320R
Brush 288
Comms 22, 26, 27, 28, 29
2Charles1 (Patrol Captain)
2Edward 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 10, 11, 12
Engineer 325
2King 1 & 5 (canine units)
Lookout 03, 41, 50, 51 57, 62 (Palomar), 86 & 87 (KCB591 Boucher Hill), 13 (High Point)
Patrol 21, 22, 23, 24, 33, 34, 41, 42
Prevention 24
Ranger 2
Rec 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 31
Trails 21, 25
2Tom 2 (LEO Trainee)
Utility 28, 36
Adding Utility 28
320R
Brush 288
Comms 22, 26, 27, 28, 29
2Charles1 (Patrol Captain)
2Edward 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 10, 11, 12
Engineer 325
2King 1 & 5 (canine units)
Lookout 03, 41, 50, 51 57, 62 (Palomar), 86 & 87 (KCB591 Boucher Hill), 13 (High Point)
Patrol 21, 22, 23, 24, 33, 34, 41, 42
Prevention 24
Ranger 2
Rec 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 31
Trails 21, 25
2Tom 2 (LEO Trainee)
Utility 28, 36
I've set up a 380-425 Yagi pointed at Santiago Mountain for listening to the UHF link on 406.525 that rebroadcasts traffic on CNF Forest Net's various tones/sites.
It is oriented correctly in the vertical plane but this photo makes it look a bit rotated.
SBF's Forest Net with tone 141.3 is rebroadcast on 409.1875 which also seems to be on Santiago. I can hear it really well here.
It is oriented correctly in the vertical plane but this photo makes it look a bit rotated.
SBF's Forest Net with tone 141.3 is rebroadcast on 409.1875 which also seems to be on Santiago. I can hear it really well here.
p1879
Member
- Joined
- Mar 15, 2004
- Messages
- 380
referencing the 151.940 MURS comment about Lookouts using it....a lot of times lookouts like to chat with another LO, but not be on a COMM, or otherwise USFS channel where everyone on the Forest can hear it. Even though the general public can hear the MURS frequencies, the USFS radios are not set up for that, to my knowledge.
Lookouts do like to get to know each other, and it is certainly not unknown for romance to blossom between them, as they frequently have like personalities--appreciating the outdoors, etc. The listeners within the agency may be quite attuned to nuances in the dialog of the LO's, and perhaps this "outside" channel gives them some small degree of discretion and isolation from the other employees.
Another possibility, is sometimes they may want the other LO to take a gander at something they have seen, but may be dubious as to what it is they have spotted. This could be an effort to not unnecessarily stir up the whole Forest if it is something quite uncertain. This may be as innocuous as telling the other LO there are a lot of falling stars that night, etc. Or, it could be what they think is a dust cloud, but not a smoke, and they want an opinion from the other LO's, before they get on Forest Net and get stuff rolling.
Lookouts do like to get to know each other, and it is certainly not unknown for romance to blossom between them, as they frequently have like personalities--appreciating the outdoors, etc. The listeners within the agency may be quite attuned to nuances in the dialog of the LO's, and perhaps this "outside" channel gives them some small degree of discretion and isolation from the other employees.
Another possibility, is sometimes they may want the other LO to take a gander at something they have seen, but may be dubious as to what it is they have spotted. This could be an effort to not unnecessarily stir up the whole Forest if it is something quite uncertain. This may be as innocuous as telling the other LO there are a lot of falling stars that night, etc. Or, it could be what they think is a dust cloud, but not a smoke, and they want an opinion from the other LO's, before they get on Forest Net and get stuff rolling.
I dunno about all of that. Unpaid volunteers still have to follow all of the rules and regulations that any USFS employee has to follow. Same with the USAF CAP and USCG Auxiliary. USFS has plenty of simplex frequencies for keeping chitchat and speculation off of Admin and Forest nets. Boucher Hill and Palomar lookouts aren't that far apart but a handheld MURS with its low power and little antenna will be limited in range.
p1879
Member
- Joined
- Mar 15, 2004
- Messages
- 380
151.940 Usage between LO's. : All good points, and a cell phone better for flirting visiting, etc. , anyway. My speculation may be meaningless.
So what are they using the MURS frequency for, as it seems like traffic between LO's is occurring on 151.940 per Peter SD911. Maybe he can let us know the nature of the traffic?
One of the good things about MURS, is that use of a better antenna, as long as you stay 2 watts or less, is allowed.
So what are they using the MURS frequency for, as it seems like traffic between LO's is occurring on 151.940 per Peter SD911. Maybe he can let us know the nature of the traffic?
One of the good things about MURS, is that use of a better antenna, as long as you stay 2 watts or less, is allowed.
How about the historically under-paid and under-loved USFS folk stopped at WalMart on the way up the hill and bought a blister-pack of MURS radios because it was cheaper/easier/faster than the official channels for getting more or servicing their official radios? Seen that many times over the years in various public-safety environments, especially before handhelds became standard-issue to most. Even before those blister-packs were available, and they had to pay up for "real" radios.
High Point, Boucher and Los Pinos.
Those are the towers I hear.
Attachments
I've never heard of lookouts having numbers. Do the numbers refer to specific persons staffing the lookouts? How are the numbers used over the air? I've had these questions since the first time I saw you list them, but put off asking you until now, for some reason.
They were probably using the blister pack radios for communicating within their own crews, or intra crew communications, which typically consisted of logistics type traffic only. Now all the hotshots have one of four frequencies accompanied by one of the 16 CTCSS frequencies. These are the national crew nets. This gives 64 hotshot crews unique freq/tone combinations, but there are about 116 hotshot crews so interference is possible. I don't know what they do when two crews are assigned to one incident and share a combination. There are more frequencies available now and higher channel capacity radios now, as well as more radios assigned to crews.
When I was in the USFS (1974-1999) use of non government radios was a significant violation of policy. Of course MURS and GMRS/FRS services did not exist. CB handhelds were true bricks then. They worked very poorly as well, especially around chainsaws and other motorized equipment.
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Being solitary positions lookouts like to talk to each other. They are truly alone for a longer period of time in remoter locations than most of the population experiences. They form a social circle both while in the lookout and in social circles away from the lookout. We had field only tacticals unique to our forest back in the late 70's - early 80's on a forest in New Mexico I was working on. By design, the base stations (dispatch, district ranger stations) could not receive these frequencies. Once these frequencies were assigned and equipment placed in the lookouts it did not take long for the lookouts to use these as chat channels at night. One night I followed a conversation between two lookouts on another district that began to get a bit specific when the subject of physical romance came up. Knowing I wasn't the only person that could hear this, especially including the general public, I had to report what I heard. The night time conversations came to an abrupt halt. I guess the lookouts figured no one could hear them or some such nonsense. Too bad the conversation turned to that, they had a good thing going up to that point. What can I say? I put the frequencies in my scanner right after we were assigned the new radios.
I've known that some lookouts have amateur licenses and used to talk to each other on 2 meter/70 cm simplex frequencies. No matter the type of radio being used, even GMRS/MURS, lookouts should be aware that their signals travel a long distance, given the lookouts locations. Lookouts need to converse in a manner that pays homage to the lack of privacy that their conversations are.
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Looking at what I've actually logged I'd think they were assigned per person so that Dispatch knows who they are chatting with
Lookout 03, 41, 50, 51 57, 62 (Palomar), 86 & 87 (KCB591 Boucher Hill), 13 (High Point)
The numbers could be recycled whenever that volunteer leaves the program.
