New Legacy Scanner Upgrade Program

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wa8pyr

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Let's put this discussion to bed

I've avoided chipping in on this debate, but I've heard enough so the time has come.

The fact that seems to be escaping a lot of people is that the "time bomb" which kicked in on July 1 apparently wasn't applied to the firmware until late in May, after Whistler announced their very generous program to update Pro-668, PSR800 and Pro-18 radios to new firmware, with continued support. After that announcement, anyone who downloaded v4.6 and applied it to a different radio was really skating on thin ice; with a legitimate avenue of upgrade in place (for radios which they were under absolutely no obligation to support), it's perfectly understandable that Whistler would take more drastic steps to prevent this kind of behavior.

The fact that the unofficial project was ended after Whistler announced the official upgrade program speaks volumes.

As noted in an earlier post(s), Whistler's disclaimers (wherever found) are pretty clear that applying the firmware to a radio for which it wasn't intended could cause the radio to stop functioning; their continued attempts to deter this kind of behavior through changes to the firmware also make it pretty clear that they did not approve of what was going on.

Had the hacked firmware updates been applied with nothing more in mind than improved P25 performance for these poorly performing, orphaned and unsupported radios (P25 being a feature these radios already had), I suspect Whistler may have looked the other way; however, when the updates added reception of a mode these radios never offered (especially after an offical upgrade path was announced), a line was crossed.

Would it have been nice of Whistler to make an explicit warning that scanners loaded with hacked firmware after a certain date would be locked to that version? Certainly. Were they obligated to do so? Not in the slightest, especially since their other disclaimers already warn that radios could stop functioning.

The simple fact remains that those who upgraded their radios with hacked firmware assumed all risks of damage or loss of function. Whistler could even argue that those who continued to apply the hacked update after the official upgrade program was announced were now knowingly trying to avoid paying for the upgrade, essentially committing theft.

Is the fact that the affected radios can no longer be upgraded or downgraded incredibly annoying to those who are affected? Absolutely. But those folks still have a scanner that's functioning better than it was in it's original state, and by applying a hacked version of the firmware, they accepted the risk that the radio could stop functioning in some way or another.

No amount of debate is going to change what's happened. If someone chooses to no longer patronize Whistler as a result of what's happened to their scanner, that's their decision, but to blame Whistler when the responsibility lies with the user is really stretching things a bit too far.
 
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willtorres918

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I've avoided chipping in on this debate, but I've heard enough so the time has come.

The fact that seems to be escaping a lot of people is that the "time bomb" which kicked in on July 1 apparently wasn't applied to the firmware until late in May, after Whistler announced their very generous program to update Pro-668, PSR800 and Pro-18 radios to new firmware, with continued support. After that announcement, anyone who downloaded v4.6 was really skating on thin ice; with a legitimate avenue of upgrade in place (for radios which they were under absolutely no obligation to support), it's perfectly understandable that Whistler would take more drastic steps to prevent this kind of behavior.

The fact that the unofficial project was ended after Whistler announced the official upgrade program speaks volumes.

As noted in an earlier post(s), Whistler's disclaimers (wherever found) are pretty clear that applying the firmware to a radio for which it wasn't intended could cause the radio to stop functioning; their continued attempts to deter this kind of behavior through changes to the firmware also make it pretty clear that they did not approve of what was going on.

Had the hacked firmware updates been applied with nothing more in mind than improved P25 performance for these poorly performing, orphaned and unsupported radios (P25 being a feature these radios already had), I suspect Whistler may have looked the other way; however, when the updates added reception of a mode these radios never offered (especially after an offical upgrade path was announced), a line was crossed.

Would it have been nice of Whistler to make an explicit warning that scanners loaded with hacked firmware after a certain date would be locked to that version? Certainly. Were they obligated to do so? Not in the slightest, especially since their other disclaimers already warn that radios could stop functioning.

The simple fact remains that those who upgraded their radios with hacked firmware assumed all risks of damage or loss of function. Whistler could even argue that those who continued to apply the hacked update after the official upgrade program was announced were now knowingly trying to avoid paying for the upgrade, essentially committing theft.

Is the fact that the affected radios can no longer be upgraded or downgraded incredibly annoying to those who are affected? Absolutely. But those folks still have a scanner that's functioning better than it was in it's original state, and by applying a hacked version of the firmware, they accepted the risk that the radio could stop functioning in some way or another.

No amount of debate is going to change what's happened. If someone chooses to no longer patronize Whistler as a result of what's happened to their scanner, that's their decision, but to blame Whistler when the responsibility lies with the user is really stretching things a bit too far.
Absolutely agree with you 100%. There is no arguing especially after the experiment was over. I am one of the few that have a locked scanner, I know it was wrong, I have already accepted it as my doing and no one else's.
I found the experiment very interesting and let my curiosity lead me beyond the end of it but had every intention on having my radio officially upgraded. That ship has sailed now. All I'm hoping for is that Whistler would be willing to help us out in the future.

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APX8000

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Maybe someone should create a firmware upgrade to improve LSM reception on their products too...LOL. They can market it to Uniden as well.


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Ed6698

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Which is great, except for the fact that they are updated through the EZScan software. No mention of it there. I can't think of the last time that I visited the "download pages". The warning that I mentioned earlier, should have been broadcast on rr.com, email and in EZScan.

That may be true, but I believe the radio could not be updated unless the unit or code was altered in the first place. I don't think the radio would even accept it, unless something was altered. Someone altered the radio/code to allow the radio to accept it, and that is the end user.
 
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Maybe someone should create a firmware upgrade to improve LSM reception on their products too...LOL. They can market it to Uniden as well.


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Lmao......

I can only imagine the next bich session we have on here...

Topic Name :

"Private Software Programmer develops LSM fix for Whistlers failed P25 scanners. Free software update. Whistler files lawsuits on programmer for causing modifications to software"

Hell... I'd donate some money for a LSM fix!
 

scan18

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The fact that seems to be escaping a lot of people is that the "time bomb" which kicked in on July 1 apparently wasn't applied to the firmware until late in May, after Whistler announced their very generous program to update Pro-668, PSR800 and Pro-18 radios to new firmware, with continued support. After that announcement, anyone who downloaded v4.6 and applied it to a different radio was really skating on thin ice; with a legitimate avenue of upgrade in place (for radios which they were under absolutely no obligation to support), it's perfectly understandable that Whistler would take more drastic steps to prevent this kind of behavior.

Regarding this part above, CPU version 4.6 was released on March 17, well before the official upgrade offer was announced. The DSP version 3.1 was released on May 22, just after the upgrade offer was announced but the DSP upgrade did not require "hacker" tools to install, it was done through the EZScan software. In my case, I already had CPU 4.6 on my scanner when the upgrade offer was announced and I intended to partake in the offer. I think most people assumed it was "harmless" to update to DSP 3.1 since it was done via the EZScan software.

For the record, I am taking responsibility for my scanner being "locked" from the official upgrade. I've accepted it and won't make a huge deal out of it. But I just wanted to clarify regarding your comment above that I'm sure there are several people that fully intended to partake in the official upgrade and never touched a "hacker" tool once the upgrade was announced and still ended up getting "locked out".

What I should have done was reverted back to original RS firmware as soon as the upgrade offer was announced. As others have said, hindesite is a wonderful thing.
 

MichaelBhere

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I do not believe you can update the DSP using the Whistler EZ scan pc app with a GRE or RS unit unless you ran Eric's tool to trick the pc app that it is a Whistler scanner.


I just saw a post from Whistler Wendy that looks like they are addressing the issue of those caught in the middle between Eric's tool and Whistlers right to defend their FW..
 
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And now there is an official upgrade path for "locked" scanners.
https://forums.radioreference.com/w...rade-gre-radioshack-scanners.html#post2795824

According to the Release from Whistler Wendy done a few minutes ago. I quote the following in part....

"Because we value our customers and would like to offer them the top level of service possible, we are offering those that may have used the unauthorized upgrade code the ability to still upgrade their scanners for a fee of $89.99. This higher fee is simply due to the fact that we must replace the logic board in the scanner versus those who did not update with the unauthorized upgrade. This is a pass through cost only. Customers who have not participated in the unauthorized upgrade may still upgrade their unit at the fee of $59.99."

The part that is very interesting and very consistent to corporate greed is the following...

"have used the unauthorized upgrade code the ability to still upgrade their scanners for a fee of $89.99. This higher fee is simply due to the fact that we must replace the logic board in the scanner versus those who did not update with the unauthorized upgrade."

So this is going to cost me now $30 MORE then the original $60 for regular upgrades. This will now cost us more money because Whistler decided to cripple the scanners. All because they got upset that someone created, keyword CREATED a way to make better use of their own scanners.

They/WE didn't STEAL your Files, Technology, your code. But instead you (Whistler) graciously offer to fix a damage caused explicitly by YOU for an additional $30. YOU damaged the Logic Board. NOT I, ME or US. Definitely NOT the creator of the tool.. That is a BIG SLAP IN THE FACE! For that I will continue to post in every social media that I use my DISDAIN for your lack of respect to your own customers. EVENTUALLY you WILL understand that without US, this forum, its MEMBERS, Whistler is NOTHING!

To sum it up....Good Job on Fixing this mess you (Whistler) have caused. The way you RETALIATE is now made very public. Keep up the good! lmao
 
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Interesting to see how this Whistler/Radio Shack Scandal has almost 27k views so far on this website alone. This thread and another 668 tool are probably the most viewed. That's not counting the remaining social media sites.
 

MichaelBhere

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According to the Release from Whistler Wendy done a few minutes ago. I quote the following in part....

"Because we value our customers and would like to offer them the top level of service possible, we are offering those that may have used the unauthorized upgrade code the ability to still upgrade their scanners for a fee of $89.99. This higher fee is simply due to the fact that we must replace the logic board in the scanner versus those who did not update with the unauthorized upgrade. This is a pass through cost only. Customers who have not participated in the unauthorized upgrade may still upgrade their unit at the fee of $59.99."

The part that is very interesting and very consistent to corporate greed is the following...

"have used the unauthorized upgrade code the ability to still upgrade their scanners for a fee of $89.99. This higher fee is simply due to the fact that we must replace the logic board in the scanner versus those who did not update with the unauthorized upgrade."

So this is going to cost me now $30 MORE then the original $60 for regular upgrades. This will now cost us more money because Whistler decided to cripple the scanners. All because they got upset that someone created, keyword CREATED a way to make better use of their own scanners.

They/WE didn't STEAL your Files, Technology, your code. But instead you (Whistler) graciously offer to fix a damage caused explicitly by YOU for an additional $30. YOU damaged the Logic Board. NOT I, ME or US. Definitely NOT the creator of the tool.. That is a BIG SLAP IN THE FACE! For that I will continue to post in every social media that I use my DISDAIN for your lack of respect to your own customers. EVENTUALLY you WILL understand that without US, this forum, its MEMBERS, Whistler is NOTHING!

To sum it up....Good Job on Fixing this mess you (Whistler) have caused. The way you RETALIATE is now made very public. Keep up the good! lmao

I fail to understand your rational for corporate greed. Whistler is replacing a board that probably cost them more then $30 and only charging $30. Seems the lesson to be learned is do not take what is not yours to do with it as you please.when licence agreements and royalty payments are involved.

If someone applied a tool to get premium service from my basic service cable box by tricking the cable box into thinking I have premium service and I was caught, I would be prosecuted for it.

Not looking to start an argument, I just fail to see how this has anything to do with corporate greed if they are not profiting financially from those that put their scanner at risk with Eric's tool..
 

BrianG61UK

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They/WE didn't STEAL your Files, Technology, your code.

I assume you do see that if you copied a Windows 10 DVD and hacked it so that you could use it on your PC without paying then you'd be stealing?

Why is hacking Whistlers firmware to work on a different scanner from one that was sold with, or the promise of DMR compatibility to come soon was sold with, any different?

Please do not respond with a complaint that Whistler damaged your scanner, I am NOT, in this response, saying anything about the rights or wrongs of that. I don't feel I can make any definite comment on that without knowing how the license/patent owners (of the AMBE+2 codec used in DMR) regard this unauthorised use of their algorithm on devices for which any relevant license fees presumably haven't been paid.
 
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JustLou

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According to the Release from Whistler Wendy done a few minutes ago. I quote the following in part....

"Because we value our customers and would like to offer them the top level of service possible, we are offering those that may have used the unauthorized upgrade code the ability to still upgrade their scanners for a fee of $89.99. This higher fee is simply due to the fact that we must replace the logic board in the scanner versus those who did not update with the unauthorized upgrade. This is a pass through cost only. Customers who have not participated in the unauthorized upgrade may still upgrade their unit at the fee of $59.99."

The part that is very interesting and very consistent to corporate greed is the following...

"have used the unauthorized upgrade code the ability to still upgrade their scanners for a fee of $89.99. This higher fee is simply due to the fact that we must replace the logic board in the scanner versus those who did not update with the unauthorized upgrade."

So this is going to cost me now $30 MORE then the original $60 for regular upgrades. This will now cost us more money because Whistler decided to cripple the scanners. All because they got upset that someone created, keyword CREATED a way to make better use of their own scanners.

They/WE didn't STEAL your Files, Technology, your code. But instead you (Whistler) graciously offer to fix a damage caused explicitly by YOU for an additional $30. YOU damaged the Logic Board. NOT I, ME or US. Definitely NOT the creator of the tool.. That is a BIG SLAP IN THE FACE! For that I will continue to post in every social media that I use my DISDAIN for your lack of respect to your own customers. EVENTUALLY you WILL understand that without US, this forum, its MEMBERS, Whistler is NOTHING!

To sum it up....Good Job on Fixing this mess you (Whistler) have caused. The way you RETALIATE is now made very public. Keep up the good! lmao

Give it a rest. Whistler took some of the responsibility, now it's time to take some yourself.
 

scan18

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Correct. Installing DSP 3.1 on a non-Whistler branded scanner DID require "hacker" tools.


Yes, in order to get DSP 3.1 on a Pro668 , it required the "hacker tool" initially to update the firmware. But my point was that I'm sure there are several people (including myself) that were experimenting with the tool PRIOR to the upgrade announcement, then ended up having the scanner updated to DSP 3.1 via EZScan later. Once I learned of the official upgrade, I fully intended to take advantage of it. I did not continue to experiment with hacked tools in order to knowingly avoid paying for the upgrade. Unfortunately, I waited too long before attempting to roll back to original RS 668 firmware.

Regardless, now we know there is a solution. I have no problem paying the extra $30.
 
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I'm not going to debate my opinion to every single member that disagrees with me. I'm not going to convince anyone that I am either Right or Wrong. I'm not here to force my agenda on anyone. This is just like politics. You have your version on what Party is Right and which Party is Wrong and I have my version. As long as you respect the persons views, then we are conducting ourselves as Adults. If not, then we are acting like animals. I, myself prefer to be on the side of the Adults.

I have aired my concerns based on What has Happened, What I Did, What I Saw, and What was Done by parties DIRECTLY involved. None of my information is Hearsay. My posts on this matter are pretty clear especially when I compare the jailbreaking of Apple devices to that of Whistlers Device. If you don't know about Jailbreaking, then do some research and be fully aware of what is being done in this day and age.
 

Ed6698

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Sounds like Whistler took a reasonable way to provide a solution to this issue IMO, considering the circumstances of how this hack was obtained and distributed.
 
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