SDS100/SDS200: Finally got my sds100 need some guidance on programming it.

[dave3825]

if i add a site that has the control channel and several alternate channels can i delete the alternates and not add them and just add the control channel to save scan time?

So if you delete the alternates, and the control channel changes, and the alternates are not there, the system will not work. Some never change and some change on a schedule or when the guy running the system decides to change it.

Don’t mess with freqs that are in sites that the software downloaded.

I know this but half the fun is learning what your new gadget can do and how you can master it

Your new gadget shares the same basic trunking principles as sdr software. If you don't have the control and alternates, you may not hear anything. And on some systems alternates are used as voice channels and without them, no voice.

Your question asked about scan speed time. The way a scanner works is, they more your scanning, the less you hear, hence the main reason many of us run multiple dongles with like SDRTrunk Unitrunker DSDplus etc. I get maybe an hour and a half of scanner listening during the day but my PC is recording 24/7 so if something of interest happens, I have it all available for immediate playback.

i used sentinel to put in a couple nxdn single freqs i know of but those don't show nxdn in sentinel but they do in dsdplus.

If they are known to be NXDN and they are listed in the database as something else, please make a submission stating they are NXDN.

 

[AngWay]

The SDS100 can be put on the screen. The scanner needs to be out of Mass Storage mode.
Take it out of Mass Storage mode then go to the Comm. Port menu then click the Auto Detect button. Select the scanner in the list then click the 'Set Selected Available Port. The scanner should show in ProScan.
If the scanner can't be detected then go to the Windows Device Manager then see if the scanner shows up in the comm ports.

Great thank you very much i got it working

 

[RMason]

Ok if i add a site that has the control channel and several alternate channels can i delete the alternates and not add them and just add the control channel to save scan time?

Removing the "extra" control channel frequencies will not measureably reduce your scan speed. Once the scanner finds the control channel for a site, it remembers that frequency. It does not need to check the other control channels unless the control channel is lost.

However, the scan speed is impacted by programming multiple sites on the same system. The scanner will attempt to check each site for activity. It takes 1-2 seconds to check for traffic on each site before moving on. Removing (or avoiding) the out of range sites, or those that do not carry the radio traffic you are interested in, will speed up your scanning. (This is an example of “The more you scan, the less you hear.”)

 

[AngWay]

Removing the "extra" control channel frequencies will not measureably reduce your scan speed. Once the scanner finds the control channel for a site, it remembers that frequency. It does not need to check the other control channels unless the control channel is lost.

However, the scan speed is impacted by programming multiple sites on the same system. The scanner will attempt to check each site for activity. It takes 1-2 seconds to check for traffic on each site before moving on. Removing (or avoiding) the out of range sites, or those that do not carry the radio traffic you are interested in, will speed up your scanning. (This is an example of “The more you scan, the less you hear.”)

Well what i did was use sentinel to find the sites i wanted and only added those sites to a favorite list, are u saying the more sites i add to my fav list the slower it will be? would it be better to make multiple fav list and turn them all on ?

And is there a way in sentinel to enter the freqs i found on dsdplus without doing in manually just set it up in sentinel ? like i found a ham site at 147.1500 . Thanks

 

[RMason]

Well what i did was use sentinel to find the sites i wanted and only added those sites to a favorite list, are u saying the more sites i add to my fav list the slower it will be? would it be better to make multiple fav list and turn them all on ?

It takes 1-2 seconds for the sds100 to check for traffic on each trunked site. If you program 2 sites, it will take 2-4 seconds for the scanner to complete each cycle. If you program 5 sites, it will take 5-10 seconds for the scanner to complete each cycle. Putting sites in multiple favorites lists will not change this.

Now, if you were talking about talkgroups: adding additional talkgroups does not affect the scan speed. (Other than stopping on more traffic)

 

[RMason]

And is there a way in sentinel to enter the freqs i found on dsdplus without doing in manually just set it up in sentinel ? like i found a ham site at 147.1500 .

You can set it up in sentinel. When I referred to manually entering frequencies in sentinel, I was referring to creating it manually in sentinel as opposed to importing it from the database.

It might look something like this.

Favorite_List
└── Amateur Radio (Conventional System)
. └── 2 Meter Repeaters (Department)
. . └── Clinchco KB4RFN 147.150 (Channel)


You might want to look at this system in Sentinel to see how it is organized and use it as a template: Alabama/Lee County/Amateur Radio

 

[AngWay]

It takes 1-2 seconds for the sds100 to check for traffic on each trunked site. If you program 2 sites, it will take 2-4 seconds for the scanner to complete each cycle. If you program 5 sites, it will take 5-10 seconds for the scanner to complete each cycle. Putting sites in multiple favorites lists will not change this.

Now, if you were talking about talkgroups: adding additional talkgroups does not affect the scan speed. (Other than stopping on more traffic)

Well here is what the fav list i am scanning looks like i went through and only selected the freqs i could receive it won't let me put in my own freqs without doing it manually

 

[RMason]

Well here is what the fav list i am scanning looks like i went through and only selected the freqs i could receive it won't let me put in my own freqs without doing it manually

What exactly are you trying to do? Where are you trying to add frequencies? What steps have you tried? (Need more info before trying to help)

 

[AngWay]

What exactly are you trying to do? Where are you trying to add frequencies? What steps have you tried? (Need more info before trying to help)

Just in the fav lists in sentinel it will let me add what is in the database but i can't append or add my own freqs and name and stuff is it just not possible ?

 

[AngWay]

What exactly are you trying to do? Where are you trying to add frequencies? What steps have you tried? (Need more info before trying to help)

Also i put in the same freqs into the sds100 that i have in sdrtrunk and it's showing traffic in sdrtrunk but the scanner isn't picking it up .it's 854.1375 it's the AEP everything else is being picked up but that i don't know if i have a setting wrong or what

 

[RMason]

Just in the fav lists in sentinel it will let me add what is in the database but i can't append or add my own freqs and name and stuff is it just not possible ?

It is absolutely possible to add your own frequencies, sites, departments, talkgroups, etc in Sentinel.

You may want to start reading the Editing Tips in the Sentinel Programming Manual here:

BCDX36HP Sentinel Software Manual

Editing with the Favorites List Editor

Select Favorites List to edit Systems options in the right pane by clicking on field (twice) and selecting from the drop-down menus. Select System to edit Sites or Departments options in the right pane by clicking on field (twice) and selecting from the drop-down menus. Select Department to edit Channel options in the right pane by clicking on field (twice) and selecting from the drop-down menus. Select Setting and type in number setting vs. the drop down arrow. Type the first letter for text entries to get close e.g. n for None. Click to select a Setting in a column to right-click copy (for Alerts, close the window then copy). Click and drag to select multiple settings in a column to right-click paste. Click and drag to select multiple Channel Rows to copy/paste into same number of rows in new/different department (or delete). Click and drag to select multiple Department Rows to copy/paste into same number of rows in new/different system (channels not copied). Click and drag to select multiple Sites Rows to copy/paste into same number of rows in new/different system (frequencies not copied).

 

[RMason]

Also i put in the same freqs into the sds100 that i have in sdrtrunk and it's showing traffic in sdrtrunk but the scanner isn't picking it up .it's 854.1375 it's the AEP everything else is being picked up but that i don't know if i have a setting wrong or what

it's 854.1375 it's the AEP

What site is this?

Some debugging suggestions for you to try (play with):

• Use the Analyze feature to confirm you are receiving and decoding the control channel. It will indicate the signal strength, quality of the decode, and amount of activity.
• What talkgroups are being received in sdrtrunk? Are they included in the sentinel programming?
• If you are receiving the control channel, set ID Search for the system to receive talkgroups that are not programed.
  • ID Search This sets whether the scanner searches for all IDs in a trunking system (On), or scans only programmed IDs (Off).
    
    

 

[AngWay]

What site is this?

Some debugging suggestions for you to try (play with):

• Use the Analyze feature to confirm you are receiving and decoding the control channel. It will indicate the signal strength, quality of the decode, and amount of activity.
• What talkgroups are being received in sdrtrunk? Are they included in the sentinel programming?
• If you are receiving the control channel, set ID Search for the system to receive talkgroups that are not programed.
  • ID Search This sets whether the scanner searches for all IDs in a trunking system (On), or scans only programmed IDs (Off).
    
    

Ok so i should turn on ID search and that will scan everything and not just what is programmed? do i understand that right?. the site i sent you is this one. Link

I'm still not understanding how to put my own freqs into sentinel but i'm not giving up

 

[RMason]

Ok so i should turn on ID search and that will scan everything and not just what is programmed? do i understand that right?. the site i sent you is this one. Link

It will not scan "everything". It will receive all talkgroups in the trunked system - not just the talkgroups that are programmed. (e.g. it will not scan sites that are not programmed)

 

[RMason]

the site i sent you is this one. Link

Are you sure that this is the site that DSD+ is receiving? Isn't Cutler WV about 200miles from you? I suspect you are receiving a site closer to you.

<edit> Frequencies are reused within a system. Multiple sites will use the same frequency. This is part of the reason you should refer to sites by name rather than by frequency.

I would start by looking in DSD+ to see what System ID, site number and NAC it is showing when receiving this site.

 

[AngWay]

It will not scan "everything". It will receive all talkgroups in the trunked system - not just the talkgroups that are programmed. (e.g. it will not scan sites that are not programmed)

do you think it's best to leave ID search on or off?

 

[RMason]

I'm still not understanding how to put my own freqs into sentinel but i'm not giving up

Did you start by opening the Favorites List Editor?

Edit Menu -> Edit Favorites List​

 

[RMason]

do you think it's best to leave ID search on or off?

It depends on what you want to listen to. If you want to hear only talkgroups that are programmed, leave it off. I suggested it merely as a debugging step. It is useful if you think the talkgroup you want to hear is not in the sentinel database or is not programmed. If you start receiving traffic when you turn ID Search on, it is a clue as to what the issue is. (It is also useful for using the sds100 to search for talkgroups that are not in the database)

I would start first by making sure you are receiving the control channel. What system, site number and NAC is DSD+ showing for the site it is receiving? I don't think you are receiving a site that is 200 miles away. There are AEP sites much closer to your location.

 

[nessnet]

do you think it's best to leave ID search on or off?

You are asking a question that only YOU can answer.

Hypothetically:
You have a large system that has every government agency using it - dog catcher, sewer, fire, law enforcement - everybody.
You have just programmed law enforcement trunkgroups in your favorite list(s).

When you turn on ID search, you hear EVERY channel grant - dog catcher, sewer - everyone (that isn't encrypted).
ID scan - you hear just what you have programmed.

So.... do you want to hear everything?

Real world:
King County (county where Seattle is) turned up a new P25II system - PSERN.
ID search (and banks of RTL-SDRs) were used by me and a few others to identify, document and VERIFY most all the new system's talkgroups - and get them submitted into the RR database. All of the PSERN talkgroups that are in the RR database are in there because ID Search (and banks of RTL-SDRs) were used for this effort.

But, everyday, I really don't care to listen to sewer, transit, dog catcher, etc - so I certainly do not leave ID search on.

 

[Ubbe]

Removing the "extra" control channel frequencies will not measureably reduce your scan speed. Once the scanner finds the control channel for a site, it remembers that frequency. It does not need to check the other control channels unless the control channel is lost.

However, the scan speed is impacted by programming multiple sites on the same system. The scanner will attempt to check each site for activity. It takes 1-2 seconds to check for traffic on each site before moving on. Removing (or avoiding) the out of range sites, or those that do not carry the radio traffic you are interested in, will speed up your scanning. (This is an example of “The more you scan, the less you hear.”)

It only stays a minimum of 1,5sec on a site if it detects a carrier. If there's no signal then it will go thru the sites programmed frequencies at normal scan speed, some 45ch/s.

If there's no activity on the first site when scanning starts to monitor a new system it will go to next site after 1,5sec or whatever the hold time are set to above its 1sec setting. If any of those frequencies has control channel data it will stay on it for the hold time. If it detects voice channel data it will probably leave the frequency as soon as it is fully detected, maybe 100-200ms.

If a site have activity and that then ends it will skip the remaining sites in that system and go to the next system. At the next scan cycle it will go directly to that last active site.

/Ubbe