MSP Rock was on the Monkey aka Montgomery County system yesterday
MontCo system or the Montgmery site of the FIRST system?
the Montgomery County System
Please stop referring to Montgomery County like this. It destroys all credibility you have when using slurs like this.
Statewide Interoperability Radio Control Board
Quarterly Meeting Agenda
June 21, 2023, 1:00 pm – 3:00 pm
• Proposed New Primary User:
o Johns Hopkins Police Dept (JHPD)
• Proposed New Interop Users:
o U.S. Department of Health and Human Services
Quarterly Meeting Agenda
June 21, 2023, 1:00 pm – 3:00 pm
• Proposed New Primary User:
o Johns Hopkins Police Dept (JHPD)
• Proposed New Interop Users:
o U.S. Department of Health and Human Services
Curious that Hopkins' new PD wants to join the state system rather than the city's system. In one way, it follows the trend that other area universities have taken - but they were state institutions. My guess is the system is more technically and administratively stable. And maybe the new TV Hill site offers the Homewood campus area excellent coverage. Side note: Baltimore Police are still unencrypted and the man who was pushing for full encryption is leaving. We shall see.
chrgaughan
Member
Is anyone having issues with the systems in Allegany County ? I haven't heard a thing on the Cumberland City Police Channel for about a week and for some reason they are using EMS 1 for fire dispatch at times. Evything else seems ok.
Have they gone ENC by any chance? As far as EMS1 for fire dispatch, are they simulcasting on both the fire dispatch and EMS1 talk group? An SDR program like Unitrunker 2 or SDR Trunk would show the talk group assignments.
awal
Member
Well some people have issues with Prince George’s being tagged “PG” and Charles being tagged “Chuck”, so….🤷🏾♂️
I wouldn’t consider it to be a slur. i live in upper Marlboro - trust me - IVE HEARD THE SLURS!
I just laugh at the 🤡s
awal
Member
No sir -I was talking about the talkgroup not the site
Just went through the apparatus at the MSFA Convention where I noticed that the Chestertown truck on display was equipped with FIRST portables that had 1/4 wave antennas. Probably not a good idea as there is guidance that says 1/2 wave antennas should be used to achieve system design performance.
chrgaughan
Member
Usually Fire and EMS1 are not simulcasted. ENC.. maybe, I hope not because everything else will go ENC shortly afterwards. I tried 2 different SD cards that were formatted and programmed on two seperate computers ( on both cards Cumberland Police worked until about a week ago ) I'll have to dig out the SDR dongle and see what's going on )
Chris52
Member
TG - 8029 (MDE Ops.4) is very active right now via the Montgomery County Simulcast Site. 2 MDE units are on the scene of a MVA involving 2 tractor trailers on 495 at Old Georgetown Rd. It sounds like they are pumping fuel from one and mentions Baltimore. Is that where these guys are out of ? I tried listening for some sort of dispatcher but it seems it’s just the guys on the scene.
MDE is based in Baltimore at the old Montgomery Wards warehouse. I don't think that they use dedicated dispatchers per se, but they may have a consolette to use during office hours. MDE appears to use MDEM (formerly MEMA) to monitor their talk groups(s) and notify personnel via cell phone during off-hours.
Notes from the June 21, 2023 RCB meeting in Crownsville.
Discussion about the path forward after the completion of Phase / Zone 5. FIRST management is focused on evaluating new innovations as they emerge and implementing those that show promise and are useful (more later). They intend to incrementally improve system resiliency by proactively replacing equipment and working with partners to standardize equipment and connectors. The system relies on partnerships with individual agencies who actually own the infrastructure that support the system.
New Limited Primary User: Johns Hopkins University Police. They request eight talk groups and five dispatch positions for their estimated 105 TDMA subscribers / 100 officers. Their security personnel will remain on the University's current DMR? system. There is sufficient channel capacity on the Baltimore cell to support their operations.
New Interop User: US HHS. Initially to provide coordination between HHS tactical medical / special operations in the Frederick area, and various law enforcement and state and local public health partners. They intend to eventually become a Limited Primary User to provide wide area cover to supplement their own conventional radio system. 30 users.
FY24 Operating Budget of $15.8M, will increase as parts of the system come out of warranty and a new service agreement RFP is let. FY24 Capital Budget of $18.4M will support construction of four new sites, the first batch of school BDAs, and conversion of existing T1s to Ethernet. The cost of the school BDAs is $250K each, but could be less depending on the characteristics of the building. A test school is probably going to be in Cordova (Talbot County) near where three sites converge.
FIRST purchased two tactical BDAs for deployment to special events where coverage is marginal. They are manufactured by Modtech and cost about $50K a piece. The system consists of a Pelican case that contains the radio equipment and hot-swappable batteries, a donor Yagi antenna on a stand, and the transmit / receive antenna for the subscribers. It's very simple to operate: point the donor antenna at an existing site and press the green on-button. The BDA box can also run off a cigarette lighter (12V) or house power (120V).
Testing Smart Connect (WiFi and Cellular) on capable subscribers (APX Next and some APX8000). Theoretically, a subscriber could stay on their assigned talk group and drive across the country and still be connected via LTE. In-building WiFi could conceivably provide connectivity in areas where the FIRST RF cannot penetrate. Subscription fees would apply for the LTE service, and (I'm guessing) the Motorola option.
Critical Connect (system level interconnection). Test scheduled for July. This could enable WAVE, laptop dispatching, ISSI roaming, and perhaps linking with other Motorola systems with the appropriate system software level. This could enable the linking of the DC system to FIRST, where CG Sector in Baltimore could communicate with field units on DC waterways. This was previously done with a temporary consolette at a FIRST site within RF range of the DC system and patching the talk groups together.
FEMA Region 3 (PA,DE,MD,WV,VA,DC) talk path. The purpose is to link the SWICs together with a common talk group, but unsure whether or not this is worth the squeeze. Could use Critical Connect or consolette patching.
Tower site upgrades:
Repaired shelter at Johnson DNR tower site; various backhaul improvements; Appleton plugs (standardized power connectors); Hardening sites.
Howard County simulcast cell will likely need additional channels.
T1 to E (thernet) upgrade for Phase 1 - 4 design complete and will require Motorola to visit every site in Zones 1 and 3. To be completed by November 2025 when the current contract ends.
Long lead times for generators and shelters (and curiously 75' telephone poles) affecting timelines for FY23 sites.
700 MHz non-trunked Air to Ground channels now in service.
FY23 new sites.
Swallow Falls: Delayed by shelter and generator supply chain issues, but civil work underway. March 2024.
Greenbriar State Park: Woodpeckers have made the planned telephone pole installation problematic, so a new pole has been ordered - but apparently there is a shortage of 75' poles - who knew?
Davidsonville: December 2023.
FY24 new sites.
Cumberland: Looking for a hilltop site.
Patapsco State Park: Joint venture with Howard County. Expecting 18 months of permit work.
Queenstown: Joint venture with Queen Anne's County, probably on SHA property.
Elmer School Road: Hoping the site validates - don't want to go through another tower order with the pesky NIMBYs in Montgomery County (I'm allowed to say this because I grew up in Montgomery County).
NCR site: Still awaiting grant funding. One site in DC, possibly another in Arlington.
Howard Wastewater site: Although now part of the simulcast cell, the antennas still need to be raised.
Fun fact: there are BDAs in the State House Complex.
Motorola has verified Verizon Wireless / ATT FirstNet Band 13 / 14 interference in the 700 MHz Public Safety Band in the lab. It is occurring nationwide. (This will be a big deal.)
Discussion about the path forward after the completion of Phase / Zone 5. FIRST management is focused on evaluating new innovations as they emerge and implementing those that show promise and are useful (more later). They intend to incrementally improve system resiliency by proactively replacing equipment and working with partners to standardize equipment and connectors. The system relies on partnerships with individual agencies who actually own the infrastructure that support the system.
New Limited Primary User: Johns Hopkins University Police. They request eight talk groups and five dispatch positions for their estimated 105 TDMA subscribers / 100 officers. Their security personnel will remain on the University's current DMR? system. There is sufficient channel capacity on the Baltimore cell to support their operations.
New Interop User: US HHS. Initially to provide coordination between HHS tactical medical / special operations in the Frederick area, and various law enforcement and state and local public health partners. They intend to eventually become a Limited Primary User to provide wide area cover to supplement their own conventional radio system. 30 users.
FY24 Operating Budget of $15.8M, will increase as parts of the system come out of warranty and a new service agreement RFP is let. FY24 Capital Budget of $18.4M will support construction of four new sites, the first batch of school BDAs, and conversion of existing T1s to Ethernet. The cost of the school BDAs is $250K each, but could be less depending on the characteristics of the building. A test school is probably going to be in Cordova (Talbot County) near where three sites converge.
FIRST purchased two tactical BDAs for deployment to special events where coverage is marginal. They are manufactured by Modtech and cost about $50K a piece. The system consists of a Pelican case that contains the radio equipment and hot-swappable batteries, a donor Yagi antenna on a stand, and the transmit / receive antenna for the subscribers. It's very simple to operate: point the donor antenna at an existing site and press the green on-button. The BDA box can also run off a cigarette lighter (12V) or house power (120V).
Testing Smart Connect (WiFi and Cellular) on capable subscribers (APX Next and some APX8000). Theoretically, a subscriber could stay on their assigned talk group and drive across the country and still be connected via LTE. In-building WiFi could conceivably provide connectivity in areas where the FIRST RF cannot penetrate. Subscription fees would apply for the LTE service, and (I'm guessing) the Motorola option.
Critical Connect (system level interconnection). Test scheduled for July. This could enable WAVE, laptop dispatching, ISSI roaming, and perhaps linking with other Motorola systems with the appropriate system software level. This could enable the linking of the DC system to FIRST, where CG Sector in Baltimore could communicate with field units on DC waterways. This was previously done with a temporary consolette at a FIRST site within RF range of the DC system and patching the talk groups together.
FEMA Region 3 (PA,DE,MD,WV,VA,DC) talk path. The purpose is to link the SWICs together with a common talk group, but unsure whether or not this is worth the squeeze. Could use Critical Connect or consolette patching.
Tower site upgrades:
Repaired shelter at Johnson DNR tower site; various backhaul improvements; Appleton plugs (standardized power connectors); Hardening sites.
Howard County simulcast cell will likely need additional channels.
T1 to E (thernet) upgrade for Phase 1 - 4 design complete and will require Motorola to visit every site in Zones 1 and 3. To be completed by November 2025 when the current contract ends.
Long lead times for generators and shelters (and curiously 75' telephone poles) affecting timelines for FY23 sites.
700 MHz non-trunked Air to Ground channels now in service.
FY23 new sites.
Swallow Falls: Delayed by shelter and generator supply chain issues, but civil work underway. March 2024.
Greenbriar State Park: Woodpeckers have made the planned telephone pole installation problematic, so a new pole has been ordered - but apparently there is a shortage of 75' poles - who knew?
Davidsonville: December 2023.
FY24 new sites.
Cumberland: Looking for a hilltop site.
Patapsco State Park: Joint venture with Howard County. Expecting 18 months of permit work.
Queenstown: Joint venture with Queen Anne's County, probably on SHA property.
Elmer School Road: Hoping the site validates - don't want to go through another tower order with the pesky NIMBYs in Montgomery County (I'm allowed to say this because I grew up in Montgomery County).
NCR site: Still awaiting grant funding. One site in DC, possibly another in Arlington.
Howard Wastewater site: Although now part of the simulcast cell, the antennas still need to be raised.
Fun fact: there are BDAs in the State House Complex.
Motorola has verified Verizon Wireless / ATT FirstNet Band 13 / 14 interference in the 700 MHz Public Safety Band in the lab. It is occurring nationwide. (This will be a big deal.)
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Rockville MSP has been using the Montgomery TRS almost since inception. They have 2 dedicated talkgroups that are used all the time (I don't know if they simulcast on their own frequencies or not). I have never heard College Park/PG on them.
Yup, MSP Rockville has been on the Montgomery County system for years; the old SmartZone system and now their new P25 system. The question that was being asked was if MSP Rockville, MSP College Park, and UMD College Park Police were being heard on the FIRST system Montgomery simulcast site. The response to this question was initially unclear, thus the reason why the follow up question was asked.
Chris52
Member
Well I’ve been monitoring and recording via my “Unitrunker’ and along with my portable and I haven’t heard a peep form Rockville or Collage Park. HOWEVER they are still active on the PG System.
Chris52
Member
We are using Tac 6 (Central/NCR) to escort the fallen firefighter back to St. Marys County. We are in Waldorf headed toward Rt.5 (Mattawoman Beantown Rd) and am being told we are being heard as far north as Montgomery Simalcast site, maybe some of the Montgomery users are still listening ? I wonder if it will change as we enter further down Rt.5 into St. Marys County. It has been a flawless event with communications as all counties (even the Harris St.Marys System) has had all of the MD First TG’s with an exception on telling some folks on how to get to said zone. What a sad two days it’s been so far.
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No not yet, they will eventually, but not all the pieces are together to bring those locations online to MDFiRST.
