Erie County P25 System

[scnrfrq]

Just got another update from John Grappy on the training. I've also attached the file he references.

"Good Afternoon:
Attached is an electronic copy of the modified power point presentation, providing the dates & locations of the train-the-trainer and end-user training sessions.

Train-the Trainer Sessions have been scheduled on May 7 – 9, 2019, to be held at the Department of Public Safety, 2880 Flower Road, Erie, PA. In the best interest of our first responders, there will be three (3) train-the-trainer sessions, per day to ensure your availability to attend. Every user agency should send a member of your command staff as well as your training officer for continuing education purposes. (Please see the attached document for more information).

The Train-the-Trainer Sessions will provide instruction on the following topics:
Operation of P25 Radio System
Five (5) Zone Configuration
Talk Groups
Subscriber Equipment (control stations, mobiles, portables radios)
Operational Procedures
Law Enforcement Radio Procedures Manual
EMS / Fire Radio Procedures Manual

Regional End-User Training Sessions will be conducted over a five (5) day period beginning on May 13 – 17, 2019, to be held at various locations throughout Erie County. In the best interest of our first responders, there will be four (4) training sessions, per day (one, per zone) to ensure your availability to attend. (Please see the attached document for more information).

The End-User Training Sessions will provide instruction on the following topics:

Operation of P25 Radio System
Five (5) Zone Configuration
Talk Groups
Subscriber Equipment (control stations, mobiles, portables radios)
Operational Procedures
Law Enforcement Radio Procedures Manual
EMS / Fire Radio Procedures Manual

Emergency services personnel are encouraged to attend one of the end-user training sessions on the operation and functionality of the new radio system. In the event you cannot attend the end-user training in your specific zone, you may attend any other training sessions being offered throughout the week. No advanced registration is required; the venues were selected to accommodate a large number of our first responders to conduct the training sessions. You will have an opportunity to discuss the next steps towards implementation of the new radio system moving forward.

Upon conclusion of the training sessions, Erie County, in conjunction with EF Johnson / Mobilcom and our first responders will be conducting extensive field testing to ensure coverage requirements have been met. Per our specifications, a minimum of 2,000 points of interest to include outdoor and indoor coverage testing will be conducted. The date and time of the testing will be coordinated by the Department of Public Safety to ensure your availability to begin field testing of the new radio system (May / June 2019).

Erie County Department of Public Safety will not transition users onto the new P25 Radio System until “system acceptance” testing has been successfully completed, training has been conducted and confidence in the operation and performance of our new radio system has been demonstrated to our first responders, municipal and county officials. Cutover or go-live is anticipated no later than mid-summer 2019."

 

[terryho]

Heard some more voice testing today, hopefully they have done their fleet planning, and will get going on the training. I’m sure my son will be trained soon since he is a chief, and hopefully we will have more info about the system!

 

[scnrfrq]

Mike M. is checking for me on providing a list of TG's and any training materials he's permitted to.

 

[scnrfrq]

Heard activity on Testing 4 and 6 today. Audio does sound good.

 

[terryho]

Looks like more delays

 

[terryho]

Maybe easier to read.

 

[scnrfrq]

Maybe easier to read.View attachment 70903

And on and on it goes. What a surprise that the radios are obsolete after not implementing the system 3 years ago according to the original schedule. I wonder if it will ever be operational?

 

[GTR8000]

Seriously? They are not "obsolete", they are simply lacking some of the latest and greatest features, however they would work just fine on the system today, tomorrow, and years from now. Do you realize what a huge win for the county and all users of the system it is that the manufacturer is going to swap out older radios for the brand new models, at ZERO cost? Stuff like that does not happen, believe me. The system was never going to be fully operational by the end of summer anyway, they still have quite a lot of work to do, not the least of which includes thorough testing with full foliage on the trees to ensure that the system actually works.

Please, try to put your cynicism aside for a minute and understand the positive impact this will have on the system and the users going forward. Yes, delays are frustrating, but if not for those delays with this system, they may not've been able to make this agreement.

We started planning our county's system in the mid-2000s, and it was originally designed as a Phase I FDMA system on T-Band. The planning process dragged out, which of course frustrated everyone involved, but it wound up being quite fortuitous in the end. Motorola came out with the G-Series repeaters, which featured linear amplifiers and thus were capable of Linear Simulcast Modulation (LSM), a much improved modulation over previous iterations. The 700 MHz spectrum also opened up, and so the system design was changed from T-Band to 700 MHz. Well ask anyone in a T-Band area affected by the impending giveback if they'd like to be on 700 MHz instead right now. And the Phase II TDMA spec was finalized before the system went on the air, allowing us to take advantage of that as well to double voice capacity.

Silver linings.

 

[N3KGD]

Equipment Upgrade Delays Launch of Erie County's Next Generation Radio System
www.erienewsnow.com/story/40415574/equipment-upgrade-delays-launch-of-erie-countys-next-generation-radio-system

 

[N3KGD]

First Generation Radio equipment to be replaced in fall for part of Erie County

www.yourerie.com/news/local-news/first-generation-radio-equipment-to-be-replaced-in-fall-for-part-of-erie-county/1983719962

 

[WB3DYE]

Mike M. is checking for me on providing a list of TG's and any training materials he's permitted to.

Question: why ask for that info about TG's when I understand everything will be encrypted

 

[scnrfrq]

Question: why ask for that info about TG's when I understand everything will be encrypted

Not really. Only PD's other than Millcreek. That leaves a lot of TG's in the clear. Anyway, that's all months down the road now....

 

[wrath]

Not really. Only PD's other than Millcreek. That leaves a lot of TG's in the clear. Anyway, that's all months down the road now....

Months ,i am willing to bet ,they don't have this miss carriage running in full service before Christmas 2020!



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[MarkPalmer]

And on and on it goes. What a surprise that the radios are obsolete after not implementing the system 3 years ago according to the original schedule. I wonder if it will ever be operational?

I just roll my eyes and laugh out loud to myself with everything I read in regards to this radio system. Back when they awarded EF Johnson to be the equipment vendor over Motorola, I said to myself "Big mistake number one." We had a Johnson system out at the college, and it literally couldn't get out of its own way. Dixie cups and strings would have worked better. Everyone just gave up and used cell phones.

 

[scnrfrq]

I just roll my eyes and laugh out loud to myself with everything I read in regards to this radio system. Back when they awarded EF Johnson to be the equipment vendor over Motorola, I said to myself "Big mistake number one." We had a Johnson system out at the college, and it literally couldn't get out of its own way. Dixie cups and strings would have worked better. Everyone just gave up and used cell phones.

So that's why I saw Kathy D. driving that truck full of cups and strings to the 911 Center!

 

[wrath]

The strings went on after an epic all night beer pong game ,celebrating there victory in spite of themselves

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[Railbender]

Took a ride today and visited 4 tower sites. Interesting that regardless of the tower the system identified as site 001 (Urban) or site 002 (Rural). Not sure if this is the norm with simulcast systems. With StarNet each tower has a unique ID.

Twice in the past few days I have heard simulcast testing on both sites with a noticeable time difference in the transmissions.

 

[GTR8000]

Took a ride today and visited 4 tower sites. Interesting that regardless of the tower the system identified as site 001 (Urban) or site 002 (Rural). Not sure if this is the norm with simulcast systems. With StarNet each tower has a unique ID.

That's precisely how simulcast works. Simultaneous broadcasting of the same transmissions on the same frequencies at multiple physical locations (subsites). There is no uniqueness to any subsite within a simulcast cell as far as the over-the-air transmissions are concerned, they all identify the same and make up a single virtual "site".

OpenSky is not simulcast, it is made up of standalone, individual sites. The same talkgroup can be active at multiple sites, but that is not the same as simulcasting, it's more of a multi-cast situation (same transmissions on different frequencies). If you're talking about the P25 STARNet system, that system is made up of a combination of standalone, individual sites and a few simulcast cells.

 

[MarkPalmer]

The longer they delay getting this system working, the more they prove that the county never really needed it to begin with. They more or less took away the aspects that they were selling everyone on the system to begin with, there have not been any serious reliability issues with the current analog system, and the latest nonsense involving hardware that is supposedly "obsolete" before it even went in to service is absolutely ludicrous.

 

[scnrfrq]

The longer they delay getting this system working, the more they prove that the county never really needed it to begin with. They more or less took away the aspects that they were selling everyone on the system to begin with, there have not been any serious reliability issues with the current analog system, and the latest nonsense involving hardware that is supposedly "obsolete" before it even went in to service is absolutely ludicrous.

Well said!