SDS100/SDS200: SDS100 Firmware 1.03.03M/1.01.05S Open Beta

[UPMan]

Seen some improvement with this update. Looks like we're on the right track! One issue I'm still getting is in this log file. RSSI rotates between -45, -85, blank, doesn't show DATA, doesn't decode, even though I'm in the coverage area.

This system/site:
https://www.radioreference.com/apps/db/?siteId=10819

Log file:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/0ee78w8dln0hexl/log0391041.zip?dl=0

According to the log, the signal quality seems to be very poor. Scanner has a hard time even locking onto the control channel. What are NOISE and D-ERROR values (these are more important than RSSI for SDS100...D-ERROR will probably mostly be --- if no channel lock).

 

[UPMan]

Sarasota County Trunking System, Sarasota County, Florida - Scanner Frequencies

Had difficulty locking onto Site 001 CC (with a strong signal) and chopped/missed transmissions.

According to log, RSSI is high, but NOISE is also high. For SDS100, NOISE is actually more important than RSSI, as it indicates overall noise floor of the RF signal. High NOISE makes reception difficult, even when RSSI shows strong. Some factors can make RSSI high, even though actual signal is poor.

Make sure you are away from RF noise sources (computers, monitors, Wi-Fi hotspots, power supplies, etc,) which can increase the NOISE...usually 3-4 feet away is plenty, but I'd first try standing outside to see if this is improved, then move toward your normal listening environment.

Since SDS100 uses a completely different receiver design than any other scanner, it can be subject to RF noise in different ways than other receivers...some cases more sensitive to noise and other cases less sensitive.

 

[UPMan]

I am reporting SDS100 reception issues with the following system:
Parma Simulcast P25 Phase 1 System Cuyahoga County. A Harris P25 System.
https://www.radioreference.com/apps/db/?sid=5133

Note: There are three P25 Simulcast systems in Cuyahoga County. Cleveland GCRCN (Motorola), MARCS-IP (Motorola) and Parma P25 (Harris). The P25 reception issue's are unique to Parma's Harris system.

Monitored the Parma system using: BCD436HP vs SDS100. The BCD436HP, no missed traffic.

1. SDS100 misses traffic. Screen stays black. Entire broadcasts not recieved.
2. SDS100 activates the screen, all of the typical information is displayed. No audio from the speaker.
3. SDS100 display activates, 1 to 2 seconds of missed audio. Then the audio starts.

Note: I am supplying logs for both the SDS100 and also the BCD436HP, as a possible means of comparison. RS800 BNC antenna's were used on both radio's. Both radio's were place on the kitchen table about 18" apart and were both running on batteries. I started the debug log on the BCD436HP first, then I started the debug log on the SDS100. I stopped the debug log on the SDS100 first and next I stopped the debug log on the BCD436HP.

SDS100 debug log: log0027696

BCD436HP debug log: log0026047

According to the log, the signal is very weak into the SDS100. Double check settings (ATT?), connection to the antenna, and receiving of other systems. Maybe try using the stock antenna on SDS100 (if the actual signal is strong, RS800 shouldn't make that much difference).

 

[sibbley]

According to the log, the late entry to the conversation is due to the scanner still holding on the previous conversation (hold time had not expired). You can change this behavior by changing the hold time (shorter will improve, but at the cost of missing more replies to a current conversation).

Ok, thanks. I'll reset channel delay back to 2sec and retry latest beta. I had it at 3 because I was missing too many replies to current conversations.

 

[UPMan]

Cleveland Indians Baseball Company: NXDN NEXEDGE 4800
The radio system for Progressive Field. https://www.radioreference.com/apps/db/?sid=8750

For the last two years I have monitored the activities at Progessive Field the Home of the Cleveland Indians, using my BCD436HP attached to a SuperSonic SC-602 HDTV Indoor Antenna. It's a desktop directional (yagi) antenna. I also monitor the Indians games with my TRX-1 scanner using it's Whistler RS800 clone antenna.

There are 14 Talk Group's listed in the RR Database. But I have monitored 20 Talk Groups. The six outstanding have not been fully ID'd so they can not be posted in RR.

During the ball game, with all of the venues and support groups involved, it's virutally non stop traffic.

This past Sunday I connected the SC-602 antenna to the SDS100 and monitored the Indians support staff during the game. Much to my surprise the SDS100 caught only a very small portion of the Indian's traffic. The display would light up and show the usual information, but only a very few times was the audio decoded. My TRX-1 was also monitoring the Indians game and was very active.

After roughly a half hour of mostly silence. I removed the SDS100 from the SC-602 and I connected the BCD436HP. The 436 immediately became active, full audio.

Attached is a log file from the SDS100 monitoring Sunday's Indians game.

According to the log, it seems that some channels are wrong LCNs, or these signal quality is not good. Since BCD436HP using the same programming (confirm this) does not see the issue, it is likely a signal quality issue.

Good decoded LCNs:
164, 183, 405 (Control Channel)

LCNs which can hardly be decoded:
203, 453, 1003

After double-checking programming, I would apply IFX to the hard-to-decode frequencies (451.2625, 452.825, 464.8875). Also, since BCD436HP and SDS100 use radically different RF designs, it is possible that the SDS100 could be more (or less) affected by local sources of RF interference such as PCs, TVs, power supplies, Wi-Fi hot spots, etc. For testing, I would try to isolate such sources ... easiest is usually to just go outside with your setup to see if this helps. Actual signal should not increase by much, but locally generated RF noise will dramatically decrease (by the square of distance to the source).

If performance improves when outside, then look to see what noise sources could be present at your normal antenna location and try to isolate away from those. Typically a few feet can make a huge difference with local RF sources.

 

[UPMan]

I dont know if i done this right but i am trying this out. After several days of use with the latest beta most operations have been great but i have noticed alot more frequently on a very good signal monitoring p25 phase 2 that some of the comms are still clipped,dropped and beginning of transmissions not picked up quick enough. I was monitoring Starcom21 in Illinois. Now the later one could be that they start talking before they key the mic( i know alot of people that do that). Also some times but not too bad i get a signal but no audio. From the log i added to this post i do believe i got some of those issues mentioned. I hope i have helped the group of SDS100 users. I have now went back to the public release at this time till the next release which i hope is soon.

According to the log, you are scanning multiple sites. In that case, it is normal to miss comms on one site when the scanner is checking some other site(s). For testing, it is better to scan fewer (or even only one) site at a time, to eliminate this kind of normal missing comms.

Also, according to the log, the site with a control channel frequency of 851.925 MHz could have an incorrect NAC in RRDB. Move the system to an FL (if it is not already) and remove the NAC from that site. The CTCSS/DCS/NAC field in the scanner's display will flash the correctly received NAC. If it is not the same as is in RRDB, please submit a correction so that this can be fixed at the source.

 

[UPMan]

Gotcha but in this case there was voice traffic on several hits and the LED stayed off. I'll capture a debug log.

During hang time on Connect Plus the display stays on CON+ same as voice. Even though the V-CH changes, it is still considered a single "event" if the replies occur during the channel hang time.

Example for Sequence of TGID A:
TGID A grant on C-CH -> V-CH Data 1 -> Hang Time -> V-CH Data 2 -> Hang Time -> V-CH Data 3 -> Hang Time -> Return to C-CH

In this case, TGID alert runs only when the scanner received TGID A grant on control channel.

 

[jonwienke]

In this case, TGID alert runs only when the scanner received TGID A grant on control channel.

The issue I was documenting/logging was a UID not alerting on the SDS100. On the 436, the alert light consistently comes on when the UID programmed to alert is displayed. But on the SDS100, it's fairly common for the UID Name to be displayed, (e.g. UID 12204 "Adams Fire/EMS Dispatch"), but the alert associated with that UID is not triggered. So when Adams County Unit 12204 keys up, both the 436 and SDS100 will display "Adams Fire/EMS Dispatch", but only the 436 shows the programmed yellow alert light.

 

[werinshades]

According to the log, the late entry to the conversation is due to the scanner still holding on the previous conversation (hold time had not expired). You can change this behavior by changing the hold time (shorter will improve, but at the cost of missing more replies to a current conversation).

Ok, thanks. I'll reset channel delay back to 2sec and retry latest beta. I had it at 3 because I was missing too many replies to current conversations.

I think UPMan is referring to Site Hold time and not Channel Delay.

 

[sibbley]

I think UPMan is referring to Site Hold time and not Channel Delay.

I hope not. Site hold times have been set at 0.

 

[UPMan]

I was referring to channel delay.

 

[Bolt21]

Make sure you are away from RF noise sources (computers, monitors, Wi-Fi hotspots, power supplies, etc,) which can increase the NOISE...usually 3-4 feet away is plenty, but I'd first try standing outside to see if this is improved, then move toward your normal listening environment.

Most of my monitoring is done while mobile. Would a ferrite core choke on the power cable be an option?

 

[WX4JCW]

Most of my monitoring is done while mobile. Would a ferrite core choke on the power cable be an option?

External antenna?


Sent from my iPhone 8 using Tapatalk Pro
Jason WX4JCW
XPR7550 - SDS100

 

[JamesO]

Most of my monitoring is done while mobile. Would a ferrite core choke on the power cable be an option?

Many of the cigarette lighter USB converters and phone chargers can put out an entire nuclear reactor worth of noise. I have one in my truck that does not seem to impact my scanner, but it will totally wipe out all receive on my CB radio. About 7-9 on the S meter so I have to unplug the current USB phone converter when I plan on using the CB radio.

Need to dig though my box of USB devices and see if I have a cleaner USB converter otherwise I may end up building one with a 5 Volt linear device.

 

[N6ML]

According to log, RSSI is high, but NOISE is also high. For SDS100, NOISE is actually more important than RSSI, as it indicates overall noise floor of the RF signal. High NOISE makes reception difficult, even when RSSI shows strong. Some factors can make RSSI high, even though actual signal is poor.

Make sure you are away from RF noise sources (computers, monitors, Wi-Fi hotspots, power supplies, etc,) which can increase the NOISE...usually 3-4 feet away is plenty, but I'd first try standing outside to see if this is improved, then move toward your normal listening environment.

Since SDS100 uses a completely different receiver design than any other scanner, it can be subject to RF noise in different ways than other receivers...some cases more sensitive to noise and other cases less sensitive.

Speaking of NOISE ... what is that measured in? I added it to my "Detail Trunk" display, and it's showing a wildly varying number, from 3 digits to high 5 digits, even with no antenna connected (and nothing connected to either USB port).

Has any consideration been made for some smoothing/averaging of the RSSI and NOISE numbers? When they're jumping around and updating so frequently, it's difficult to get useful numbers.....

 

[UPMan]

It is the raw NOISE value coming out of the SDR circuit. AFAIK it is in generic "units".

 

[N6ML]

It is the raw NOISE value coming out of the SDR circuit. AFAIK it is in generic "units".

OK, so what is considered "high", then ?

 

[scrotumola]

see below

 

[scrotumola]

and








Are the [FONT=&quot]site NAC entries correct?[/FONT][FONT=&quot]

[/FONT][FONT=&quot]Please copy that system to favorite list and set that site NAC to Search, and try again.[/FONT]

The NAC is irrelevant in this case. The radio is deaf no matter what mode or band it is in. VHF, AM, FM, FMN, 800 -Edacs/ P25 PI doesn't matter, all I receive is rythmic kerchunking.

I have instructions from Jenna at Uniden and the unit is going back this week as soon as I get off shift.

~S~
___

 

[wx5uif]

The NAC is irrelevant in this case. The radio is deaf no matter what mode or band it is in. VHF, AM, FM, FMN, 800 -Edacs/ P25 PI doesn't matter, all I receive is rythmic kerchunking.

I have instructions from Jenna at Uniden and the unit is going back this week as soon as I get off shift.

~S~

Mine was doing the same thing, so back it went yesterday.

Before that it was working flawlessly here. It just stopped receiving.